Curse

Isison · Dec 26, 2007, 05:42 AM // 05:42

why don't you try a "you farm and give me all gold" challenge?

aapo · Dec 26, 2007, 05:45 AM // 05:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by You can't see me

Pardon me, I have a question. Why would I do this with the knowledge of PuGs and crafter armor I have?

- Oh yeah forgot to put FAQ:

Q: I hate Guild Wars! Do I have to do this?
A: No, you don't. This is voluntary.

Q: PUGs are just baed. They can't do anything.
A: Which is why it's a challenge. If you're in PUG does that make you a bad player too?

Q: I hate people, I don't want to be near them.
A: You don't have to do this, it's a suggestion for those who don't mind playing with others.

Bryant Again · Dec 26, 2007, 06:21 AM // 06:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by aapo

But that's the thing, when you have heroes and henchmen which follow your every command and use optimized builds for every situation, it makes the game seem much easier than it was originally intended (for non-optimal human parties that is).

Well for one, Heroes and henchies don't always follow my every command. The AI in GW is very subpar.

Secondly, you're saying that the game is challenging because of PUGs? The difficulty should be in the game and not with who I play with. That's a whole other problem in itself, and is one of the reasons I do play with heroes and henchies.

Also bear in mind that heroes and henchies are only as good as the player the uses them. If you give them to a newer player, they won't last long.

Quote:

Originally Posted by aapo

2. What are the biggest problems of Guild Wars as a social game. How well you found parties and what were the difficulties with them.

The only manufactured problem ANet created with GW was the party requirement. Having to have a full party of 8 is a *lot* of people, and having it be required for nearly every area now is pretty lame. Couple this with the highly limited Party Search and complete seperation of the game populous through instancing and outposts and it becomes highly apparent how ineffective it is.

This could very well be one of the reasons ANet wanted to move onto GW2, and I am very glad that it'll be entirely soloable. It's definantly the best (and maybe only) thing that MMO's can learn from Hellgate:London.

Of course the other problem is how shitty the playerbase is, but that can't really be helped.

aapo · Dec 26, 2007, 07:29 AM // 07:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bryant Again

Secondly, you're saying that the game is challenging because of PUGs? The difficulty should be in the game and not with who I play with. That's a whole other problem in itself, and is one of the reasons I do play with heroes and henchies.

- No. I'm saying difficulty of PvE was adjusted to be played with human party. It *was* challenging, near impossible to play with just henchmen on harder missions like Thunderhead Keep. Factions was a bit better with wider range of henchmen roles for different areas. Then Nightfall just said, heck make your own synergistic henchmen and equip them with vigor runes too. No wonder everything is so easy and boring.

Bryant Again · Dec 26, 2007, 08:03 AM // 08:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by aapo

No. I'm saying difficulty of PvE was adjusted to be played with human party. It *was* challenging, near impossible to play with just henchmen on harder missions like Thunderhead Keep.

Thunderhead Keep was the turning point for many a H/Her. A common experience was to fail over and over again with pug after pug, only to hench it, camp the middle, and win. It was because of this that many questioned the quality of pugs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by aapo

Then Nightfall just said, heck make your own synergistic henchmen and equip them with vigor runes too. No wonder everything is so easy and boring.

It's not any easier. Hell, it's probably harder: Only 3 henchmen you can really customize, use a lot of skills poorly/stupidly, and still suffer the same stupid GW AI. Not to mention a whole H/H team can only use 3 PvE skills. A human party of 8 can hold 24.

The only difference is convenience and risk. Would you want to spend over 10 to even 30 minutes putting together the perfect human party or spend 10-30 seconds setting up one of AI? In terms of risk, heroes and henchies have none of those. They'll never bail on you in the middle of a mission or go AFK all of a sudden because their grandpa got run over by a car while he was getting Chinese food (that was an actual in-game excuse I heard.)

They may make the game look easier because they help you breeze through the game hella fast. But that's because you need nearly no downtime whatsoever. You don't have to wait for someone to use the bathroom, get something to eat, etc. Just log in, "Enter Mission", you're set.

Pleikki · Dec 26, 2007, 09:25 AM // 09:25

I know how we could do it fun and hard! Complete game without using any skills!
just dmg from weaps :P

zwei2stein · Dec 26, 2007, 09:44 AM // 09:44

* There is no returning back to blisfull noob days. You cannot undo experience. It wont be fun again.

* Game is not easy because of heroes. Proof is, as said, Henching that opened eyes and existed before heroes: sooner or later everyone realizes that missions are not hard because they are designed to be hard, but because they are with incompetent people. for me that mission was Elona Reach. Decent build on heroes are just icing of cake.

* People tend to stabilize on whats most fun way to play game (that includes convenience and not failing). Seems like humankind is not fun to play with. Loosing is not fun.

* Gimping yourself is fun only if you are masochist.

What about you doing that challenge yourself and THEN report back with experience.

Zeek Aran · Dec 26, 2007, 09:56 AM // 09:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by zwei2stein

* Gimping yourself is fun only if you are masochist.

arsie · Dec 26, 2007, 10:04 AM // 10:04

You gotta PuG or AB once in a while to show off your rare skin weapons.

Zeek Aran · Dec 26, 2007, 10:05 AM // 10:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by arsie

You gotta PuG or AB once in a while to show off your rare skin weapons.

Please explain relevancy.

the Puppeteer · Dec 26, 2007, 10:17 AM // 10:17

how about doing the game with no skills and only solo?

Sha Noran · Dec 26, 2007, 10:25 AM // 10:25

PvE too easy? Try playing PvP instead of gimping yourself just for the sake of additional frustration. Honestly, it's going to be a slow frustrating grind to do as the OP suggested, so how about all of you PvE kids crawl out of your caves and try some IWAY.

Seriously, I hate when people suggest playing the game badly on purpose. Minesweeper isn't really hard, but that doesn't mean I'm going to click random boxes just to make it harder to win.

Viruzzz · Dec 26, 2007, 11:17 AM // 11:17

I hate to say this, but it's probably the stupidest challenge i have yet seen.

No storage is basically a luck gamble, if you get some decent weapons that you can salvage something from it makes everything easier then if you for example don't get a weapon your class can use.
This says nothing about the game-design, if you take a tool available to you and decide not to use it, then the problems you encounter has nothing to do with anybody but yourself, the problem only exists because you made it a problem.

human pugs, so many reasons this is stupid.
PuG's are generally not very capable, it takes an enormous amount of effort to get a decent team of 8 players, Why? because the decent players know that most people suck at the game, so they H/H it instead,saves them a lot of frustration
There's nothing *FUN* in trying to work with a bunch of egoistic teenagers who all think they're a freaking rocket-scientist
Judging the quality game by the people who play it doesn't make sense

You can not re-create the noob feel in a game you already know! It is impossible, you can't just leave your experience behind, you'll end up with a lot of frustration where you long ago felt amazement and accomplishment, because you know whatever you just did was done badly, and could easily have been done better and more efficiently.
If you want to be a noob again, find another game to play, a different genre, thats the only way you can recreate it.

aapo · Dec 26, 2007, 01:10 PM // 13:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sha Noran

Seriously, I hate when people suggest playing the game badly on purpose. Minesweeper isn't really hard, but that doesn't mean I'm going to click random boxes just to make it harder to win.

- I didn't say play badly on purpose. I said play the best you can without utilizing things that make the game trivially easy. Did I make myself clear?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viruzzz

Judging the quality game by the people who play it doesn't make sense

- It makes lots of sense. Everything you do is your choice and there's a very clearly defined target audiences for products.

Tyla · Dec 26, 2007, 01:12 PM // 13:12

look at empty missions -_-"

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viruzzz

You can not re-create the noob feel in a game you already know! It is impossible, you can't just leave your experience behind, you'll end up with a lot of frustration where you long ago felt amazement and accomplishment, because you know whatever you just did was done badly, and could easily have been done better and more efficiently.
If you want to be a noob again, find another game to play, a different genre, thats the only way you can recreate it.

QFT!
miss the old days

angmar_nite · Dec 26, 2007, 01:50 PM // 13:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by aapo

Also being able to coordinate PUGs will also help one's social skills, which makes big difference in PvP world where you have to succeed in human team.

Coordinating a PUG is NOTHING like coordinating a crack HA or GvG team. And my social skills are fine, thank you.

Turtle222 · Dec 26, 2007, 02:06 PM // 14:06

crap idea

Complete waste of your life.

lyra_song · Dec 26, 2007, 02:23 PM // 14:23

I've done the "No storage" challenge before when i got my Factions Monk.

Its actually not very hard if you aren't a martial class where you need optimum weapons.

I stopped when i reached lvl 20.

Rexion · Dec 26, 2007, 03:05 PM // 15:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicken Ftw

I'd rather gouge out my eyes with a spoon and eat them. While being mauled by rabid raccoons and having my skin scraped off with sandpaper.

Well you just accepted that challenge because you obviously aren't doing the OP's challenge. Seriously, think before you post.

This is more of a "like the good ole days" type of challenge. When all we had was 1 character and were basically poor. But it won't change the communities mind on respect. When games start, everyone is nice because they want help from others. Now that the community/economy has developed, there is no need for respect because they can get what they want themselves.

Chicken Ftw · Dec 26, 2007, 03:38 PM // 15:38

Except it's not a challenge, it's an exercise in masochism. One that would frustrate the hell out of people who like to do things efficiently, and those who find fun in winning. Before you say it, I'm not antisocial. I play with my guild and friends all the time. If you think I'm going to abandon these good players for ones who think warriors are meant to be tanks and paragons are useless, you're insane.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viruzzz

You can not re-create the noob feel in a game you already know! It is impossible, you can't just leave your experience behind, you'll end up with a lot of frustration where you long ago felt amazement and accomplishment, because you know whatever you just did was done badly, and could easily have been done better and more efficiently.
If you want to be a noob again, find another game to play, a different genre, thats the only way you can recreate it.

This man speaks the truth. You've already been there, done that. While doing it all again this way is ok for nostalgia purposes, you won't have the same feeling as you did back in Proph beating THK for the first time, or whatever.